John Conduitt Posted September 10, 2022 · Supporter Share Posted September 10, 2022 Charles III is the new King of the United Kingdom, and as such reigns over Scotland. But he isn't King of Scotland. That's a title that disappeared with the Acts of Union 1707. Even so, the demise of the King of Scotland began with the death of Queen Elizabeth and the crowning of King Charles. Only it was Elizabeth I and Charles I. Elizabeth I, as Queen of England, was not keen on getting married. It was disadvantageous to do so, since any husband would become King and take her power, while any children would spark a fight for the succession.Elizabeth I Third Issue Threehalfpenny, 1561Tower. Silver, 16mm, 0.71g, medium flan. Crowned bust (3G) of Elizabeth I left, large rose behind head; E · D · G · ROSA · SINE · SPINA; mintmark pheon both sides. Long cross fourchée over small quartered shield of arms below divided date within inner circle; CIVI TAS LON DON (S 2569). Elizabeth I was the last English monarch not to also be the Scottish monarch. On her death, the crown passed to her cousin, James I. The complication was that he was already James VI of Scotland. This resulted in the unification of the crowns, albeit as separate kingdoms. This worked somewhat like a unification bout in boxing, where the victor wins all the belts but they each remain independent entities that could be won by different challengers. James left for London, and quickly forgot his Scottishness and Catholicism. To be fair to him, striking a balance between Protestants and Catholics, and England and Scotland, was probably the trickiest challenge in British political history.James VI and I Second Issue Shilling, 1605-1606Tower. Silver, 31mm, 5.77g. Crowned fourth bust to right, value to left; ·IACOBVS·D·G·MAG·BRIT·FRA·ET·HIB·REX·. Quartered arms, privy mark rose; QUAE·DEVS·CONIVNXIT·NEMO·SEPARET (S 2655). From the Kempen (North Brabant, Netherlands) Hoard c2020, Buried in 1616, it contained various European gold and silver coins, suggesting it belonged to a Dutch merchant. It was something of a miracle that James died a popular monarch. True, he started the Plantation of Ulster, which would lead to a whole other saga, but that's a different story. His son, however, was not so diplomatically gifted. Charles I was the last British monarch to be born in Scotland. (Elizabeth II is the last British monarch to die in Scotland - you have to go back to James V, who was a King of Scotland, for the previous monarch to die there in 1542). But by the time of the Civil War, even the Scots wanted him gone.Charles I Group D Shilling, 1635-1636Tower. Silver, 29mm, 5.96g. Fourth bust type 3a with falling lace collar, facing left, large XII behind bust, no inner circle; mint mark crown; CAROLUS D GMAG BRI FR ET HIB REX. Round garnished shield with no inner circle mint mark crown; CHRISTO AUSPICE REGNO (S 2791). From the Ewerby (Lincolnshire) Hoard 2016, buried by 1643 during the English Civil War. Having intially allied with Cromwell, the Scots were soon at odds with the English parliament. In 1651, they crowned Charles II as King of Great Britain, France and Ireland, although effectively he was only King of Scotland. In response, Cromwell invaded Scotland, and Charles II and his Scottish army had to flee.Charles II Farthing, 1675Tower. Copper, 21.5mm, 5.90g. Laureate and cuirassed bust of Charles II left; CAROLVS·A· CAROLO. Britannia seated left, holding spear in left hand, olive branch in raised right hand, shield with Union flag resting at left, date in exergue; BRITAN NIA· (S 3394). This is the first appearance of Britannia on a coin since the Roman Empire. The demise of the Commonwealth - the republican political entity rather than the royalist association of nations - resulted in Charles II's unexpected elavation to the English, Scottish and Irish crowns. This union of separate crowns under one monarch survived another revolution until finally the kingdoms of England and Scotland were united into the Kingdom of Great Britain in 1707. This was under Anne - the Last Queen of Scotland.Anne Sixpence, 1703Tower. Silver, 21mm, 3.01g. Draped bust left, in fillet; ANNA DEI GRATIA; VIGO below bust. Crowned cruciform shields for England, Wales, Scotland and Ireland; MAG BR.FRA ET.HIB REG (S 3590). 'VIGO' indicates this coin was struck from silver captured at Vigo Bay during the War of the Spanish Succession. But this may not be the end of the story. In Scotland, the death of Elizabeth II raises the question of independence. Charles III is not so popular. Many proponents of Scottish independence are republican, since they see the monarchy as a symbol of England's tyranny over them. Yet if Scotland did become independent, there's no reason they couldn't take their monarch with them. Charles III - the last King of Scotland? 14 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor robinjojo Posted September 10, 2022 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted September 10, 2022 (edited) Very nice coins, John. Here's a sword ryal, 1571, I that purchased from Karl Stephens in 1997. While being king of Scotland, at thirteen months in 1567, James early years were under a regency, under four regents during his minority, which ended in 1578. It was during his reign in Scotland that his mother, Mary Queen of Scots was executed on February 8, 1587 at Fotheringhay Castle, in Northamptonshire, after 19 years captivity by Elizabeth I of England. Scotland, James VI, Sword Ryal of 30 shillings, 1571. Dav 8467 30.4 grams Edited September 11, 2022 by robinjojo 10 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UkrainiiVityaz Posted September 10, 2022 · Member Share Posted September 10, 2022 Really? Charles III was born in 1720 and passed away in 1788. He had a far more legitimate claim to the crown, religious objections excepted. He lead the Jacobite rebellion in 1745 and was defeated by Stinking Billy Cumberland at the Battle of Culloden in 1745. 9 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UkrainiiVityaz Posted September 10, 2022 · Member Share Posted September 10, 2022 James III was born in 1688 and passed away in 1766. This medal commemorates the birth of Charles III, Prince of Wales in 1720. 9 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Conduitt Posted September 10, 2022 · Supporter Author Share Posted September 10, 2022 (edited) 25 minutes ago, UkrainiiVityaz said: He had a far more legitimate claim to the crown, religious objections excepted. Well, not considering his grandfather lost in battle to William III. If that wasn't a legitimate route to the crown, we should all be subjects of Cassivellaunus XL. Great medals though, for an interesting period of history. Edited September 10, 2022 by John Conduitt 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Conduitt Posted September 10, 2022 · Supporter Author Share Posted September 10, 2022 2 hours ago, robinjojo said: Very nice coins, John. Here's a sword ryal, 1574, I that purchased from Karl Stephens in 1997. While being king of Scotland, at thirteen months in 1567, James early years were under a regency, under four regents during his minority, which ended in 1578. It was during his reign in Scotland that his mother, Mary Queen of Scots was executed on February 8, 1587 at Fotheringhay Castle, in Northamptonshire, after 19 years captivity by Elizabeth I of England. Scotland, James VI, Sword Ryal of 30 shillings, 1571. Dav 8467 30.4 grams That's a beautiful coin. These aren't so easy to get in such good condition. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor DonnaML Posted September 11, 2022 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted September 11, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, John Conduitt said: Well, not considering his grandfather lost in battle to William III. If that wasn't a legitimate route to the crown, we should all be subjects of Cassivellaunus XL. Great medals though, for an interesting period of history. Also, if we're going to adopt modern ideas of eligibility for succession retroactively, then George I and the other Hanovers still had a better claim than the Old and Young Pretenders: George I was directly descended from Elizabeth Stuart, the second child of James I, whereas the Pretenders were descended from his third child, Charles I. People forget that the oldest child of James I -- Henry Frederick, Prince of Wales -- predeceased his father in 1612, allowing Charles I, as the second son, to inherit the throne that would have been Elizabeth's under the present rules. So her line should take precedence over his if all former disabilities are eliminated. Edited September 11, 2022 by DonnaML 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor robinjojo Posted September 11, 2022 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted September 11, 2022 4 hours ago, John Conduitt said: That's a beautiful coin. These aren't so easy to get in such good condition. Thanks! I had to try different angles when taking pictures of this coin, to bring out the nice toning. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnus Maximus Posted September 11, 2022 · Member Share Posted September 11, 2022 4 hours ago, DonnaML said: Also, if we're going to adopt modern ideas of eligibility for succession retroactively, then George I and the other Hanovers still had a better claim than the Old and Young Pretenders: George I was directly descended from Elizabeth Stuart, the second child of James I, whereas the Pretenders were descended from his third child, Charles I. People forget that the oldest child of James I -- Henry Frederick, Prince of Wales -- predeceased his father in 1612, allowing Charles I, as the second son, to inherit the throne that would have been Elizabeth's under the present rules. So her line should take precedence over his if all former disabilities are eliminated. Donna, you are clearly mistaken. The last King of Scotland is “His Excellency, President for Life, Field Marshal Al Hajj Doctor Idi Amin Dada, VC, DSO, MC, Lord of all the Beasts of the Earth and Fishes of the Sea and Conqueror of the British Empire in Africa in General and Uganda in Particular.” 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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