Orange Julius Posted May 6, 2023 · Member Share Posted May 6, 2023 (edited) Hi all, A quick self-serving topic. I have this below Herakles Club/Bow coin. Looking at similar examples on acsearch, it looks like the reference attribution for this coin would be either Price 2799 or 2800. I do not have M. Price's book "The Coinage of in the Name of Alexander the Great and Philip Arrhidaeus"... so I'm hoping one of you may! I'm interested to know... What IS the difference between Price 2799 and 2800? What does the book say about these coins (dating, whose reign, mint???) ...and which is my coin? AND! As always... I showed you mine, show me yours... let's see your Club and Bow coins of Alexander and those who followed him. Thanks all. Edited May 6, 2023 by Orange Julius 9 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryro Posted May 6, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted May 6, 2023 (edited) Great coin! I like the green deposits of verdigris. Here's what Price says: Here's mine. Despite the description, price has these as likely posthumous: Alexander III 'the Great' (336-323). Ae. Uncertain mint in Western Asia Minor. Obv: Head of Herakles right, wearing lion’s skin headdress. Rev: BAΣIΛEΩΣ. Bow in bowcase (lion's head countermark on bowcase) and club; torch below. Price 2799. Condition: Extremely fine. Weight: 5.7 g. Diameter: 20 mm. Edited May 6, 2023 by Ryro 14 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Snible Posted May 6, 2023 · Member Share Posted May 6, 2023 Sometimes you can figure it out from the website: https://numismatics.org/pella/id/price.2799 Symbol (Below): torch with fillets → https://numismatics.org/pella/id/price.2800 Symbol (Below): torch ← 8 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ominus1 Posted May 7, 2023 · Patron Share Posted May 7, 2023 ...welp it just 'cordin' what you want and what they'll pay for...oh....that Price..(don't ya love a smartass..:P...)...in honor of this thread, i've taken another pic o mine...:D (plus a lQQk at all my Greek coins^^) 9 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orange Julius Posted May 7, 2023 · Member Author Share Posted May 7, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, Ryro said: Great coin! I like the green deposits of verdigris. Here's what Price says: Here's mine. Despite the description, price has these as likely posthumous: Alexander III 'the Great' (336-323). Ae. Uncertain mint in Western Asia Minor. Obv: Head of Herakles right, wearing lion’s skin headdress. Rev: BAΣIΛEΩΣ. Bow in bowcase (lion's head countermark on bowcase) and club; torch below. Price 2799. Condition: Extremely fine. Weight: 5.7 g. Diameter: 20 mm. 3 hours ago, Ed Snible said: Sometimes you can figure it out from the website: https://numismatics.org/pella/id/price.2799 Symbol (Below): torch with fillets → https://numismatics.org/pella/id/price.2800 Symbol (Below): torch ← Thank you @Ryro and @Ed Snible for the references and assistance! I like to know the differences behind the reference numbers, so this info is very helpful. So… as my torch fire is to the left, my coin is Price 2800 huh. Ok, sounds good. @Ryro also that’s a nice coin! Mine’s a bit more irregular in shape and although the added mineral color is pretty, the green and the black on the reverse of my coin makes it a bit hard to appreciate the details… as it is a crisply struck and a well preserved coin. Anyway, I like yours a lot! @ominus1 I like your coin as well! That thunderbolt on the reverse is cool! The coin looks to have nice relief and is in great condition. Love it! I also like your storage system. It’s kinda like the system I use for coins that have arrived but I have yet to research and get into the binders. Edited May 7, 2023 by Orange Julius 3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orange Julius Posted May 7, 2023 · Member Author Share Posted May 7, 2023 (edited) Ok ok ok... I have another question about the Price reference. There are two references. I'll use Ed's text for copy/paste simplicity: Price 2799 - Symbol (Below): torch with fillets → Price 2800 - Symbol (Below): torch ← I'm guessing fillets are the little tassel thingys at the bottom of the "torch." My coin seems to be a mix of the two, "torch with fillets" but "←". If you look at other acsearch listings for Price 2800, you find coins like below, torch ← (no fillets). Price 2800 example: My coin: My coin is torch (fire) left with fillets (tassels). Does that make it Price 2799v, 2800v, or another ref? I'm also just now noticing that the bow case is oriented the other direction. At what point does any of this matter! Haha, oh I love coins. So assuming the arrow → points to the top of the object... My coin is: Bow case: → Club: ← Torch with Fillets: ← ...the combination of which seems to be hard to find an example of... out of the 346 coins on acsearch found with the search words "bow club Herakles torch" there are NO examples with the same orientations. Weird. Edited May 7, 2023 by Orange Julius 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanxi Posted May 7, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted May 7, 2023 Alexander the Great Macedonia Obv. Head of Heracles right, wearing lion’s skin Rev. ALEXANΔPOY, above, bow and quiver, below, club and gorytos? AE, 5.92g, 16.7x18.2mm 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alegandron Posted May 7, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted May 7, 2023 Makedon Alexander III 336-323 BC AE 16 4-1g Salamis-Cyprus mint Herakles club bow quiver SA Price 3143Makedon Alexander III 336-323 BC AE 19 Quiver ClubMakedon Alexander III 336-323 BC AE 18 Bow Case ClubMakedon Alexander III 336-323 BC AE 17 Quiver Club 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
O-Towner Posted May 7, 2023 · Member Share Posted May 7, 2023 (edited) There's even the little half-unit type (11.8mm, 1.3gms) : Ref: Price 3334 Obv: Head of Herakles right wearing lion-skin headdress Rev: AΛEΞANΔPOY between bow in bow-case and club; AP below Edited May 8, 2023 by O-Towner 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursus Posted June 5, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted June 5, 2023 On 5/7/2023 at 6:47 AM, Orange Julius said: My coin is torch (fire) left with fillets (tassels). Does that make it Price 2799v, 2800v, or another ref? I'm also just now noticing that the bow case is oriented the other direction. At what point does any of this matter! Haha, oh I love coins. Yes, it seems a little arbitrary to me to distinguish these by orientation of the torch while ignoring the different orientations of the bowcase and club. Yet, listing all these small varieties would certainly have made Price's catalogue even more voluminous than it already is... To me, the fact that Price 2800 is more often than not countermarked is another interesting detail. Both your example coin and my specimen show a countermark that I cannot quite identify and whose function is unknown to me. Maybe someone else knows more or has a theory? Alexander III “the Great” (postumous issue), Kingdom of Macedonia, AE unit, 323–310 BC, unknown mint in Asia Minor. Obv: head of Heracles right, wearing lion skin headdress. Rev: ΒΑΣΙΛΕΩΣ, between club and quiver with bow; below, torch (countermarked). 20.5mm, 5.65g. Ref: Price 2800. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topcat7 Posted June 14, 2023 · Member Share Posted June 14, 2023 I think that the moneyers themselves got confused so one of them did away with the torch completely and put a mouse there instead. (LOL) 336-323 B.C. ALEXANDER III (The Great), Kings of Macedon, 5 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panzerman Posted November 29, 2023 · Member Share Posted November 29, 2023 Late to the game.... Macedonian Empire AV Quarter Stater ND Alexander III 6 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor kirispupis Posted November 29, 2023 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted November 29, 2023 Nice pickup! Here are a few rare Herakles with bow + club coins. Cyprus, Kourion, Pasikrates circa 325 BCE Æ 17mm 5.12g, 2h. In the name and types of Alexander III of Macedon. Head of Herakles to right, wearing lion skin headdress / Bow-in-bowcase and club; laurel branch below, ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΥ between. Price 3113; Cox Curium, 8; ANS 1944.100.26537 CYPRUS, Soloi. Pasikrates (Stasikrates) Circa 330s-310s BCE Æ Unit 18.5mm, 7.00 g, 9h In the name and types of Alexander III of Macedon. Head of Herakles right, wearing lion skin Bow-in-bowcase and club; prow upward below. Zapiti & Michaelidou 26; Troxell, Alexanders 29; Price 3099 Ionia, Erythrai c. 4th century BCE Æ 13mm, 1.82g, 3h Thrasy-, magistrate Head of Herakles r., wearing lion skin. R/ Club and bow-in-bowcase. SNG Copenhagen 598 Macedon, Philippi (as Thasian Epeiros [Krenides]) c. 360/59-356 BCE Æ 10mm, 1.49g, 6h Head of Herakles r., wearing lion skin. R/ Club and bow. Le Rider, Thasiennes 29; AMNG II/2, 1; HGC 3.1, 626 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewStyleKing Posted November 29, 2023 · Member Share Posted November 29, 2023 (edited) How is the chronology rationalised? Mixed Hoards? Do mixed ( with silver) exist? Mixed with other mints coins? Just how do they do it? I mean with WM Flinders Petrie seriation he had loads of graves to sample and stratification..... but I can't see a parallel here. Athens NewStyles are easy by comparison to get conclusions for, but not exact dates- but good enough. Edited November 29, 2023 by NewStyleKing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.